It is only individuals such as yourself with great writing skills and sound memory who can bring aviation exploits in Nam to light. Enjoyed your recollections Joe C. I was an Army Helicopter Crew Chief/Mechanic at Camp Eagle near Hue, Phu Bai then Danang MM Airfield, RVN 71-72. 17 apr 1966: arab 511, an a-1h (buno 135398), lt (jg) william l. tromp, va-115, went down following a night attack on coastal targets, near approximately 1818'n, 10610'e. arab 506, his wingman,. Wed had it. After each plane was completed, two pilots (Call signs Perky01 and Perky02) would take the plane up for a check flight. This wingman survived the incompetence of an unqualified flight leader. I met and liked John Dremesi whose experience was the same as yours. 9 of the losses were parked aircraft struck by rockets. 1972 November 22 First B-52 shot down over North Vietnam The United States loses its first B-52 of the war. The result of the egotistical attitude by the DO and the lack of courage and sound judgement by our flight leader cost Scotty Wilson his life, put me in communist prisons for over six years, resulted in my fathers untimely death at the age of 58 and a host of other horrors back home while I was away. I then drew my .38 caliber service revolver, opened the cylinder, emptied all the ammunition and threw it away. All my attention had been focused on escape and I had inadvertently bypassed the opportunity to use my emergency radio to make a distress, Mayday call. Scotty then said over the radio to the leader, Dogwood 2 has a good inertial. Pilots who have used the AN/ASN-46 nav system (Up to 7 NM per hour error) will know whats going on here. Btw, Uncle Walter was an anti-American, extreme lefty. Final loss: EC-121R 67-21495 (554th RS) crashed on approach to Korat RTAFB on 6 September 1969, 4 of the 16 men were killed. But for many years I wondered about what premonitions he also might have had that were similar to those Id had when I awakened. Cheers! I learned Russian and some higher math. There were a total a 269 American and enemy aircraft shot down in air-to-air combat over Vietnam during the entire war201 in fights between the U.S. Air Force and North Vietnamese air force and just 68 in the U.S. Navy's air battles with the North Vietnamese. Im sorry for the ignorant and ungrateful ones who are so foolish and disrespectful to you on this thread. The 1850 John Stuart Mill quote and your comment that you posted above is powerful and right on. All of a sudden, they stood me up. I will be reading your story to my young ones tonight. By 0900, my front-seater, 1stLt. Gordon Scotty Wilson and I were walking onto the north ramp to our weapons- and fuel-laden F-4C number 64-0755. I could feel them loop a rope around my neck, then attach the rope to my wrists and again, in similar fashion, to my ankles. for my family and I, is absolutely heartfelt and sincere. Date Enemy Aircraft Squardon Aircraft Weapon Carrier Service Rank Pilot RIO/NFO Note; 17 Jun 1965: MiG-17: VF-21: F-4B: AIM-7: CVA 41: USN: CDR: Louis Page : LT John C. Smith, Jr. . Joe. He wasnt much of a story teller and I didnt think to ask him about his service until after he died. At this moment the twin J-79 afterburners are briefly licking at the runway with two, huge, yellow-orange flames. I took one last look at the horizon. records. My brother got spit on when he landed in Atlanta on his way home. It was very kind of you to drive the 40 miles and spend the time to honor the memory of my brother, your fellow employee at Flying Tigers and FedEx. Vietnam War pilot tells his story of being shot down over enemy territory and his time as a POW. Hed slept in an air-conditioned hut. At 2,500 ft. The pain was unbearable except that I had to bear it whether I wanted to or not. Joe, First loss: operational (non-combat), F-4C 64-0674 (45TH TFS, 15th TFW) which ran out of fuel after strike in SVN on 9 June 1965; first combat loss F-4C 64-0685 (45th TFS, 15th TFW) shot down Ta Chan, NW NVN on 20 June 1965. North Vietnam, pre-1975: Killing of Two American Pilots Shot Down Over North Vietnam. Those of us that were there were paying attention; I remember that it was not assured, back then, if anybody would be repatriated. Just as we were positioning ourselves for the right-hand turn at Bravo, the lead aircraft unexpectedly turned to the left. I wanted to join you in 1969 after college graduation, but my eyes only qualified me as good enough for USAF navigator. So glad that you made it back in one piece, and were able to continue flying. In Reply to B. Fearn by the author of Shot Down Over North Vietnam, War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. There are plenty of other places to rant and vent. While I never got above the Cessna 180 stage of flying, I hold you and your fellow pilots in the highest esteem. All of us pilots felt lost. Knowing you were handled so badly by your bosses has to be a tough thing to take. First loss: C-141A 65-9407 (62d Military Airlift Wing) destroyed in a night runway collision with a USMC A-6 at, Final loss: C-141A 66-0127 (4th Military Airlift Squadron, 62d MAW) crashed soon after take-off from, First loss: RB-66B 53-0452 (Det 1, 41st Tactical Reconnaissance Squadron, 6250th Combat Support Group) which crashed 2223 October 1965 west of. I was an Air Traffic Controller at the Tulsa TRACON (tower and radar approach control) in January of 1981 when one of the check flights did not end well. Joe I want to start by thanking you profusely for attending and speaking at my brother Johns funeral 3 years ago. SMS D.R. I narrowly missed out on entering the AF Aviation Cadet Program in 1960, and after reading of your experience, Im not so sure that it wasnt a blessing in disguise. He was the last fighter pilot to become an ace in a day, shooting down five Indian Hawker . Of course, things were beginning to wind down in Viet Nam by this time, but it was still mega impressive to see the F-4s light em up and blast off the runway like angry rocket-powered birds of prey searching for their next meal! Your comments and wisdom are much appreciated. While my eyes and my thoughts were on flying out of enemy territory, my hands moved swiftly to the lower ejection handle while my body automatically assumed the correct ejection posture; back straight, legs extended, elbows tucked in close to the body, and BOOM. After that, I was blindfolded and transported two miles by motorcycle sidecar to another village and locked in a small building made of large stones. (Shaking head sadly) It seems theres always someone willing to take a conversation on an inappropriate tangent. Having won WWII by the application of enormous industrial power including saving the largest socialist entity in the world from the ravages of the second-largest socialist entity in the world we continued to view the world in wartime terms of us versus them and we prepared for the next war by preparing for the past war with near-total reliance on atomic weapons to win the next war. Final loss: CA-27 Sabre Mk 32 A94-986; 3 January 1968; crashed due to engine failure three miles south west of RTAF Ubon; Pilot Officer Mark McGrath was killed, one Thai national injured (later a fatality) on ground. What could I possibly say to the President of the United States that he hadnt already heard 334 times before? Like the Flat-Earthers who still dont believe we landed on the Moon. Our birds were the E series and had the internal 20 MM and made good Mig.CAP birds. Some US fighter pilots had actually scored aerial kills in WWII, and were fighting again in the sky's over North Vietnam; Colonel Robin Olds had shot down German aircraft in aerial combat,. I saw an F-4 fly low into Firebase Bastogne in January 1969 and pickle a few rounds on the guys that were over-running our base. of high-explosive surrounded by a thousand 1-inch diameter stainless steel balls inside the 6-foot long nose cone. As a former volunteer at the NMUSAF and the son of a now deceased USAAF WWII combat vet, I have always known that our country and our armed forces have been blessed with seemingly ordinary, matter-of-fact guys who do extraordinary things. I would like to hear from you at some point; [emailprotected]. God bless them! It was noon. And I mourn their deaths. I would spend the next six years and three months in five different prison camps around the city and countryside in North Vietnam; the farthest very near to the Chinese border. Bent the F-4 around after re-start and headed to his radial fix off Hue Tacan. You willingly took huge risks, knowing that that mission could be your last. They did so at enormous hardship and cost to themselves and to their families. Sorry about your Dad. Rescued Misty Pilots . What? First of all, we only had three airplanes. It was proving a good day for Navy Lt. Randy "Duke" Cunningham, and his back-seat. Page and Smith were with VF-21, and the aircraft modex was NE101. I have four children- ages 34, 30, 11 and 8 and am Grandma to 3 ages 8, 8 & 5. His first pass was- G D- Chief, 200 long. I was way back in trail, tree top, plenty of time to do 2 football fields short. We had been taught to respect and trust the higher-ups that won WWII, Little could we conceive that the USMC and the USAF began the conflict with almost total ignorance of what was required for this exercise in power projection. I could see small hooches (straw huts) on the ground. Lonely feeling for a pilot over enemy territory. The first and only fatal crash by an RAAF aircraft in Thailand. I expect Patrick Walker and his ilk were those that fled the USA because they were chicken. Just then, the crew chief, SSgt. Pair of scanning Navy A-6s. Joes epilogue sums it all up. It was great to see you as our paths crossed as we travel the world. We beneficiaries need to know the experiences, sufferings, challenges, life and death, victories and miraculous acts of God in the lives of our fellow countrymen in war, especially from their own voice and pen before the stories are gone. A man who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing he values above his own personal safety, is a miserable creature who has no chance of being free, unless made and kept so by the exertions of men better than himself.. I think there was supposed to be a moral to that story probably along the lines of smoking is always a bad idea but the way my father told the story, emphasizing how frightened the Marine was, and that he, my father, was only sitting with the other Marine to try to help him with his nerves, and to get him to calm down, well, it was obvious that this was another living, breathing, human being. I taught eight pilots who had only two-year degrees differential calculus. On 27 July 1968, Commander Mongilardi was the pilot of an A4C Skyhawk that launched from the deck of the USS Coral Sea as the section leader in a flight of two on a armed reconnaissance/strike mission over North Vietnam. Since 366thTFW maintenance was overtaxed having to do all of its around-the-clock 24/7 functions, the flight leader had to turn down two airplanes before he found one that was combat ready and airworthy. Scotty took one look at the patch which I admit looked a bit Sam Schwartz to me and replied, If we have to break for a SAM, well bring it back without the wingtip.. I hope to be delighted with more of your anecdotes. Every year on the 18th of December I start an eleven day ritual of emails to the Vietnam air warriors on the anniversary of the first night of Operation Linebacker II lest we forget the courage and sacrifices of all those who risked all from that first night until the 29th both tactical air and especially the B-52 crews. Our flight should never have been going into the target. Further, the controller COULD have joined us up and vectored us back to the truck-convoy gaggle, but the controller had obviously lost confidence in a flight leader who didnt know where he was. You need four for effective mutual support; i.e., lookout coverage for all four in all quadrants. In this MGTOW case, you had to have the stick in your lap before attaining 140 knots. Thank you, Mr. Crecca! I always get chills reading these stories. It was great to learn about your time before FTL/FDX. At this point, because of the unexpected turn, our formation was too bunched up; we were too close to each other to be able to provide mutual look-out support. [9] Another source claims that the U.S. attributed losses to surface-to-air missiles and anti-aircraft fire because it was considered "less embarrassing". A MiG-21 of the VPAF which became the primary fighter-interceptor against USAF and USN aircraft. Those bumps on the walls, in retrospect, were a poor mans acoustic treatment for trying to muffle the screams of Americans being tortured there. My father (deceased) served in the Army in Korea and my son served as an Army Combat Medic deployed to Afghanistan. Having been a teenager in Vietnam years, I had a Vietnam map on my bedroom wall and marked bombing missions that Cronkite would report that night. Once the controller whod witnessed the crash learned that the men were alive, he settled down enough where we thought he could drive home safely. Final loss: A84-228 shot down by two SA-2 SAM missiles on 14 March 1971; Wing Commander F. J. L. Downing and Flight Lieutenant A.J. Thanks for your service Joe, you are one of the countrys heros. You softy, dont deserve the freedom which we veterans fought and died for! We would have to fight if not listened to. Overcome with his Ivy League false sense of academic Superiority, he stupidly turned them down, not even a crucial, critical, disastrous war saving meeting. My father was at Danang in 67/68. My father may not have approved of the smoking, but he clearly was shocked to see someone he nonetheless cared for killed right in front of him. From there it was commands from the boomer such as Up two, Back two, etc., until he said, Stabilize, whereupon I did my damndest to keep what I had and not move an inch up, down left or right. Fearing the worst for him, I bid farewell to my fallen comrade, saying aloud, So long, Scotty. With only 300 feet to go, I prepared for my parachute landing. I knew you had endured being a prisoner but we never talked about it. By this time I was at 1,500 ft. Iwo Jima. The F-105 was one of the primary attack aircraft of the Vietnam War; over 20,000 Thunderchief sorties were flown, with 382 aircraft lost including 62 operational (non-combat) losses (out of the 833 produced). MiG-21 Units of the Vietnam War. He also stated that there were no MiG-17 aces. He had the smoke trail spotted and wanted revenge. First loss: 1964, final loss: 1967. I hope that this article and your word of mouth/teachings help other people stand up against stupidity and question the orders of those place in authority. Suddenly, I was lifted from the floor. Soviet General Fesenko, the main Soviet adviser to the North Vietnamese Air Force in 1972, recorded 34 MiG-21s destroyed in 1972. He told me join up. 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